The thing with noobs and what they become

[:1]This is more or less in response to the main page post about shared gold and the comments there.

First of all, this site is definately a great news source, thumbs up there. Then ofcourse, being independant is great aswell if it enables critical thought. I'd be the last one objecting to that, on the contrary. It's healthy.

However, I feel much of the main page negativity is more of the boohoo, blizz ruined the game for noobs kind of 'criticism'. Often cynical with the occasional cheap jab at blizz or Jay (Gee, wonder why there are no invites from that corner), especially in the last few months. Judging by the comments in aforementioned thread, I don't think I speak just for myself when I say it is getting fairly old and irritating. Luckily the speedy and copious news is a redeeming factor, but I do keep my eye open for alternatives.

Funny thing that many of those noobs that are happily bashed and of course to blame for D3 alleged dumbing down, will be next year's visitors and subscribers.

More funny things about noobs actually. They are for a large part responsible for there being a profitable gaming industry at all. I for one don't play and buy as games as I used to. Without the steady influx of nubs (more correctly 'new players/consumers), say byebye to our beloved passion.

In another way do they keep the industry alive and profitable. By actually buying and paying for the products, before some of them turn into the so called 'gamers'. A curious specimen, many members of whom display a sudden revulsion for that which they once were, belonging now to a select, higher clique. There's also the inexplicable sense of entitlement, the holy principles and the feeling the industry owes them now. Nothing new really. It does get fairly tragic here. For all the whining about gaming having become Big Business and all about the money, not about the creativity etc, when 2 guys release the fruit of their labor and savings without DRM, this is what happens: 90% piracy. When a pay-what-you-want weekend is held, by far the most people pay less than $2, 40% of those pay 0,01$ link. It appears it's not just the companies for whom it is all about the money. All in all, I think we'r lucky that most of the industry doesn't treat us all like the hypocritical pricks some of us are. It is the latter that ruin gaming, not the noobs. Let's carefully consider who we embrace and guide and who we scorn...

Just a little perspective. I don't expect to have much impact on the most rigidly convinced, but perhaps some have unwittingly adopted certain ideas and wrapped their minds around it without even really knowing. I should know. Once I *****ed like any other skilled and srs UT player about lamers (usually after being killed by them). Then someone said 'you've been influenced into hopping onto the rage bandwagon'. So i raged to that person and said 'you don't know me'. After a while I had to admit he had been 100% right.

Funny stuff.|||Well I for once think that you make some interesting points there, and there's a copious amount of bravery to saying out stuff like that. *likes*

I think the community is being split in two ways really now, a) the ex old time d2 player who legitly played and bought the game and b) the kind of player who casually played d2 and is more of a wow kind of player and enjoys most of the gameplay design choices made from d2 to d3. Ofc there`s a bunch of intersections between those two.

I for one fall into the category that doesn't really like where d3 is heading atm. I (mostly) followed the development of the game, and each time some big news was announced I was getting sadder and sadder. That's prolly because I was comparing d3 to d2.. and I still think that many of the design choices wouldn't work in the context of a game like d2. But.. in the end I realized that all in all put together d3 is nothing like a game I ever played and I really can't make a solid argument on how it is going to be without playing it.

I'm not sure where your final stand is on 'what do noobs become', but I'm positive this is not the place to start a `survey` on it. I for once enjoyed the forums for many years. People came and went. Recently I know there's a bunch of new blood around which is great, but that also creates a lot of tension between the old timers, because most of them are hardcore d2 fans. My point being is, you start cutting people some slack, and you get a lot of fuzzy information from which you can't derive definitive answers.

Just my 2 cents out there. (:|||Forgive me if my memory fails me, but AFAIK the industry was profitable BEFORE it became "mainstream".|||@lilbuddha: it was far less profitable than it is today. Just think about it, the whole technology that enabled you to get gaming into your house is pretty new: PCs, laptops, Xboxes, 360s, playstations..|||Quote:








I for one fall into the category that doesn't really like where d3 is heading atm. I (mostly) followed the development of the game, and each time some big news was announced I was getting sadder and sadder. That's prolly because I was comparing d3 to d2.. and I still think that many of the design choices wouldn't work in the context of a game like d2. But.. in the end I realized that all in all put together d3 is nothing like a game I ever played and I really can't make a solid argument on how it is going to be without playing it.




Hmm, I pretty much liked everything about the game until the "Always Online" requirement and RMAH were revealed. I especially liked how runes modded skills. Though, I recently read that at some point they get rid of skill points...I'm a bit on the fence about that (in some ways the D2 system was very annoying).

That said, I agree with you and the OP that new players are cool. I do agree everyone bashes them way too much. It's silly.|||The ironic thing about gamers is that they generally want their hobby to be socially accepted, yet they tend to resist the kind of changes that help their hobby reach a broader audience.|||Quote:








The ironic thing about gamers is that they generally want their hobby to be socially accepted, yet they tend to resist the kind of changes that help their hobby reach a broader audience.




That's just the conservative gamers. Plenty of gamers go the other way.|||I actually think there AREN'T just "two kinds of gamers"... and specifically, I don't think that knowing whether somebody is an inexperienced player tells you anything about their preferences. In other words, I think this whole "noob" label that gets thrown around is just a schoolyard slander that is pretty much completely irrelevant to the discussion.

Personally, for each of the changes we've learned about from D2... I evaluate it separately. Some I think are improvements (like the crafting system), some I think make the game worse (like the RMAH), and some I don't think I can tell about until I've played the game for some time (like the way attribute points/skills are handled). And add to that things that I think COULD have been changed for the better, but weren't (for instance, I would have liked a true single player mode with persistent world, pause, and save anywhere, which D2 didn't have either). I think that's probably true of any intelligent gamer.

I'm not a noob... go back to D1 (and long before that, back to Rogue, the precursor of Nethack in fact ) And have played dozens of other RPGs, ARPGs, MMOs, and games of many other genres as well. But you can't really predict my own personal, particular opinions based on knowing that I know plenty of people who have a similar history to mine and still have different views.

People have different playstyles and preferences, and those things are not simply predicatble from knowing how much gaming experience they have.

TL;DR: Stop calling people "noobs" and evaluate their arguments individually and on their merits |||Well said, Nun. In the world of WoW, new players and casual players are treated like lepers, and most change Blizzard does are laid at their feet; that attitude will surely trail over to the D3 community; especially any nerf to content that some people were able to get past by brute force and patience, i.e. "I did it the hard way, so can you!"|||As someone who has experience selling software, I agree. The so called "noobs" are the ones who pay, and without complaining. Considering how mainstream Blizzard has become, I'm glad they still take heed to the opinions of "hardcore" players - you and me alike.