Game developers have listened to their customers before when there was a major displeasure, so there is precedent in the mind of the complaining gamer that they can change the development of a game, or further down the road a patch will alter the game to be what they want it to be. Personally, I think it's a fool's errand... they aren't going to affect the end product, they aren't going to change the minds of most of the people on gaming forums (we are a stubborn lot by nature to change opinion)... but subconsciously they use all of this as validation that it is alright to vocally complain.
Also, I think that when they vent, even if they don't think it will affect the game, they want the validation of their fellow gamers... if we say "yes you're right" then they are not complainers anymore, now they are simply vocal leaders of the majority. They want to feel justified. In the end it is all simply "sound and fury signifying nothing".|||Quote:
I'd like to hear some feedback on why some posters maintain an almost constant negative posture to not only the game, it's design and development, but also to the readers, posters and the concept of debate.
The question could be asked why some people constantly attack those who express their dissatisfaction with certain elements of the game. I see far more "fanbois" launching personal attacks against people who complain about certain game elements than the other way around.
Not everyone shares the same opinion. Not everyone is happy about Blizzard blessing the buying of power over other players with cash. Not everyone is happy about there essentially being no builds any longer (free swapping of skills at any time.) Not everyone is happy about not being able to customize their characters (no skill points, automatic attribute assignment, knowing all class skills.) Ect.
I think it is quite ok to express one's dissatisfaction with game elements, and to do so strongly. I think it is ok to defend the changes strongly. I don't think it is ok for a person to launch personal attacks on community members who do not share his viewpoints.
We are all Diablo fans, but not all of us are fans of all of the changes being made in D3.|||Many thanks for the thoughtful responses everyone!
I agree that one positive aspect of even the most negative reactions to anything is that it proves there is passion for the subject, and thus worthwhile of affecting someone's emotions; people don't take to forums to vent about Free Cell.
@GOW: I agree with you, at least in your responses here. My statements were more on the nature of complaining in general, and what value there is in a caustic complaint over a more measured one. I personally feel that if someone starts out by saying what person A in my above example did, they stand to "lose" part of the audience who tunes out vitriol, dismissing it as rage, or getting caught up in challenging the smugness of the complaint as opposed to the issue at hand...but as we see many posts of that nature, I wondered if I was missing something, since as I mentioned some of those same people are capable of intelligent discourse.
This entire thread would be wasted on MMO-Champion, for example. The members of that forum take trolling to new lows, and if you think D3 fans are passionate...I've seen 10-15 page threads on single skill changes for a single class there, and some of the arguments are really awful, but the WoW fanbase does have a large component of young people, so they get a pass, to some extent.|||Screw Freecell! You only got 52 cards, and the Aces were overpowered. Game balance was awful, I mean if you didn't gear up with a King, then all your Queens were useless! And what the heck was up with the 5 of diamonds? I could never get that thing to spawn, even with a mod!
(Sorry, couldn't resist)|||Quote:
Screw Freecell! You only got 52 cards, and the Aces were overpowered. Game balance was awful, I mean if you didn't gear up with a King, then all your Queens were useless! And what the heck was up with the 5 of diamonds? I could never get that thing to spawn, even with a mod!
(Sorry, couldn't resist)
Well played, well played.|||Well, I'm a negative person at heart. But I do enjoy things in life.
When I saw things I didn't like about this game for example, and spend 9 paragraphs explaining why I don't like it, and bring up concrete examples of my doubts/worries/gripes;
then get a 1 sentence response such as "That's not true, you're a loser, troll, whiny entitled waaah". No intelligent rebuttal, no data to back up their claims, just pure mouth vomit.
When that happens about 100x over, you start to turn negative towards the entire entity that is the game + it's community.|||Humans are problem solvers by nature.
If you agree on something there is no problem to solve.
No matter what I say, first of all you will assume that im wrong and then search arguments to disprove what I said.
Just like now, chances are you are looking for holes in my logic.|||Quote:
I've mulled over whether to post this or not, since it is not specifically about the game, but about the community at large...since it is the community forum, I thought I'd give it a shot; if it is out of place, my apologies.
Perhaps my thoughts are not as relevant as they were say, a month ago, when the beta still seemed so far off. With its imminent release, the speculative and often combative threads we've read and participated in will give way to more specific curiosities, and arguments about what we know, and not about what we assume..perhaps I will still be relevant, time will tell.
I'd like to hear some feedback on why some posters maintain an almost constant negative posture to not only the game, it's design and development, but also to the readers, posters and the concept of debate.
Specifically, I'd like to know what the payoff is; for example, my payoff from writing this is (hopefully) satisfaction of my curiosity on certain behaviors, as well as the pure joy of writing.
So what is it that drives people to, for example, write that "system A is pure garbage" rather than "I don't like system A"? I used this specific example because the first statement is one of the criticisms that irk me, since it often comes unexplained, whereas the second needs no explanation.
Is it just passion without perspective? How do others feel about this? I suppose we could just write it off to bad manners/upbringing/lack of education, but, while that is a cop-out in and of itself, I have seen some posters here write bitter retorts in one thread, and then a thoughtful insight in another, and it perplexes me to see such, in my opinion, warring philosophies in a single mind.
Well, thanks for reading, and any feedback will be appreciated. Peace.
Easy questions to answer. First, intensity is lost through distance. That doesn't just apply to energy, it applies to the meaning of messages too. So if you say exactly what you mean, the message the other person receives will be a diluted form of what you intended. Especially online, where there is obviously a great deal of distance between random people. If you deliberately overcompensate for this, then you can get your intended point across.
Second, there is a general environment of disappointment around. Take me for example. Prior to 8/1, most of my posts were along the lines of "if x, then y". Where x is a bad design decision that could happen, and y is the negative consequences of that action. These were just hypothetical warnings though, as the only things I was really definite about in a negative way was auto stats and trait taxes because those were known then, and I did (correctly) predict that would also lead to poorly balanced skills and other things. I also remarked on such things as individual drops making it so that the multiplayer system is actually worth using this time, and that a gold AH makes the trading process not insipid. Both very good things. After 8/1 though, a lot more information was released. And most of it was negative. No offline, RMAH... not only did it add new problems, but it invalidated the previously known positive things about D3. In short, Blizzard, Slayer of Dreams. This naturally lead to me going from admitting that the games had flaws but succeeded in spite of them to loathing D3 for the twisted mockery it has become.
It's not just me either. A lot of the longer time posters either conspicuously vanished without a word, or vanished, citing something negative about D3 as the reason for their disappearance. Sass, for example. He's been an almost non presence ever since the 6 auto skill thing. He's gone on record to say he really doesn't like that, and it's easy to see why from reading his posts. In return we got the 8/11 botter alt squad, which sure isn't helping matters any.
The third thing is simple human nature. If something is working as intended, people will just use that thing (or in the case of something not yet released, continue to wait for it). If however something is not working as intended, time to complain. No feedback is in many ways equivalent to positive feedback for this reason. Of course, there's also a fair number that won't provide negative feedback and will just vanish (stop using the product).|||Quote:
Humans are problem solvers by nature.
If you agree on something there is no problem to solve.
This is very interesting approach .. I don't know what to say but I agree that negativity can somehow fix many things..
Dunno, I have to think about it..but as I said.. I found your logic interesting
|||Heh, never thought of it like that. I am biomedical engineer and "problem solving" is pretty much my day to day life, either my personality fits my job or vice-versa.
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